New #1 genoa

 

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This topic contains 20 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by  Ray 2 years, 4 months ago.

Viewing 21 posts - 1 through 21 (of 21 total)
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  • #2045

    Ray
    Participant

    Does anyone have a good suggestion for sourcing a new #1? I’m in need of one, but not wanting to sacrifice $2-3k from North or Quantum. There must be other sailmakers that make competitive sails (with respect to racing and price) out there and at these prices, shipping cost no longer matters. All suggestions welcome!

    Ray

    #3870

    Michael Hull
    Participant

    Try calling the Kingston Sail Loft (613) 531 9373 (http://kingstonsailloft.ca/). JC (sailmaker) is a former Shark World multiple-champion and had outfitted Ritalin with all her sails including our new kick-ass #3 Kevlar jib. He’s also made many sails for the other Kingston Olsons.

    #3871

    Ray
    Participant

    Just gave him a call- nice guy, but told me “dude, we’re looking at roughly $2700 for that sail”. Thank you though, Mike!

    #3872

    Michael Hull
    Participant

    He would say “dude”… ok – it was worth a try. I do know of a company that distributes dacron no-name sails out of china at fraction of retail price, but they’re not class legal and intended as practice sails or “cottage” sails (http://www.intensitysails.com/); also, I don’t think they do one-offs as their catalogue list is only for laser/opti/etc.

    Let us know if you pursue or find another discount retailer.

    #3873
    SWG
    SWG
    Keymaster

    There’s no free lunch when it comes to sails, unfortunately. Probably your best bet is to contact Todd Downey – Olson 30 class secretary, who is a quantum rep, or Keith Magnussen who is an Ullman Rep and Olson 30 sailor. Or go through your local Quantum or Ullman loft. You are not going to find a good sail that costs $1k less (for example), they will all be in the same $ ballpark like for like.

    #3874

    Ray
    Participant

    Thanks, Michael- I looked into Intensity yesterday (funny- I also need a new sail for my Laser), but decided against it since I sail almost exclusively class sanctioned races on that boat.. I just gave a quick shout to my buddy over at the Quantum loft in Charleston. I was half-way committed to Sail Technologies here in the Tampa/St Pete area (I had a quote for a mylar #1 at $1800), but I’ve heard so many complaints about the poor shape and inability to get good trim that I’m doubtful. I’d rather not spend so much on a sail that’s a hindrance like that and just deal with the “hole” I have in my current sail inventory. We’ll see what Quantum says..

    #3875
    SWG
    SWG
    Keymaster

    If you go with Quantum you may want to get Todd involved as an advice-giver, he’s Olson 30 class champion 7 times (I think) so he knows what works for an O30! The other thing is it’s a good time of year for sail purchasing, everyone has fall discounts running now or starting in a few weeks.

    #3876

    Ray
    Participant

    Really.. they’ll offer a fall discount on O30 sails? I would have thought that would be for sails they make in bulk (to shred inventory of stuff just sitting on shelves).

    #3877
    SWG
    SWG
    Keymaster

    many manufacturers give discounts in the fall. usually around 20%. i don’t think it matters what kind of sail or kind of boat. for example:

    http://ullmansailsnewportbeach.blogspot.ca/2015/08/north-american-spring-delivery-get-up.html

    #3878

    Ray
    Participant

    Holy cow- I checked out the Ulman link you posted (has a hotlink for sail quotes); a new #1 is around $4000 without discount. John just got back to me and here’s what he replied:

    >> Things are well up here. I can’t complain. $1800 is pretty cheap.
    >> The best I can do is a light mylar crosscut material. It is a
    >> polyester fiber sail and would be pretty good for you. I think the
    >> lowest I can get it to is about $2400.

    #3879
    SWG
    SWG
    Keymaster

    just to be sure you’re getting all the info you need

    Keith Magnussen

    kmagnussen@ullmansails.com

    Todd Downey

    tdowney@quantumsails.com

    #3880

    Jason Adamson
    Participant

    Ray,
    I know its a tough pill to swallow but sails, good sails, are not cheap. I a very happy Ullman Sails customer and their service is #1. My #1 GPL I got from them 6 years ago and the sail is still winning. The loft hates me because they want my business, but the damn thing just keeps going so I have no need to replace it! If you break up the cost you figure approx $500/year the sail costs so far. Who knows when I’ll have to replace it, but still its worth its weight in gold. You also don’t have to go for the highest priced sail, all of their products are of the highest quality, every material has its advantages/disadvantages.
    PS $1800 sounds pretty cheap to me, I’d be weary of the material quality/craftsmanship going into that sail.

    #3883

    Jeremy Quinton
    Participant

    Totally in agreement with Jason. Sails are not cheap!!! Cheapo’s will cost in the long run. You may get half a season if you are lucky. I am a long time Ullman customer with many different boats, but have used any maker that would give the boat the edge. Ullman’s service is great and always willing to help make the boat go faster. My boat had a major overhaul and splashed earlier this year so we are still working on a complete inventory for every wind range . Just spent 5 hours at the Ullman loft with Keith Magnussen and Bruce Cooper going over sail design on my #1 to suit my needs.

    #3884

    Ray
    Participant

    Man- my problem (besides trying to hang on to my hard-earned cash) is racing primarily phrf, so I have no real way to gauge my progress.. That, and I kinda suck as a racing sailor! Anyway- I have an old North 3DL #1 (with hanks) that I’m dragging out of the closet for Thursday night’s race. I’ll see how it fares and decide. The great thing about this upcoming race to Cuba (late Jan 2016) is that there looks to be 3 Olson 30’s racing, so I’ll finally have some basis for comparison.

    #3885

    Bill Vosteen
    Participant

    Is Kingston Sail Loft $2700 Canadian? Knock 25% off for US dollars, so about $2040 US. Though, they’re probably used to selling to US customers and quoted you US. It was a nice thought while it lasted.

    #3886

    Ray
    Participant

    I’m assuming he meant US$’s. Given the “you get what you pay for” philosophy, I’m tempted to go higher (if my sweetie will let me, of course)..

    #3887

    Michael Hull
    Participant

    In support of my local Canadian sailmaker, I called the Kingston Sail Loft (KSL) and validated that they only quote in Canadian Dollars. So the price was $2,700CAD, which given the strong USD buying power (0.76 to CAD today) is $2,052USD – a great deal!
    If it helps, they buy all their cloth from the US, so you are also supporting the US cloth distributors; also, KSL holds your USD in a US bank account to buy the US cloth such that there is no fee for currency exchange. win-win.
    And… with KSL sails, Ritalin won the Olson 30 NAs and we’re on our way to winning the Kingston YC weekend regatta series as well. win-win-win.

    #3888

    Ray
    Participant

    Just called the KSL loft back and a nice gentleman with an English accent answered the phone.. He knew a little about the sail cloth, but couldn’t really speak to the prices and fiber types, but said John will be back soon. I’d really like to compare apples to apples, so we’ll see what the aramid fiber cloth prices out for. My best reference is the Ullman website- they’ve got a complete cost breakdown for all 3 sails- kevlar, aramid and carbon. I really would prefer something with some longevity. We’ll see soon.

    #3889

    Ray
    Participant

    Just spoke with John- man, that guy has a LOT of energy! He’s going to get back to me with a specific quote, but since he’s not done much US business lately (since the crash in 2009 and lots of his US customers sold their boats), he’s not exactly sure what a Kevlar sail would cost. The price above was for a Dacron sail (which is out of the question), so he’s going to get back to me in a few once he figures out the numbers. The sad thing is that he buys cloth as you pointed out, from the US, so he’ll be charging more for the sail. That being the case, if Ullman is having a nationwide sail (not just up in Newport), and could probably order a sail from down here- we have two lofts; one in Sarasota, the other in St Pete. I’ve got an email out to Keith Magnussen asking if there is a difference between lofts (opinions vary widely between Quantum lofts), so we’ll see if that’s even a good idea.

    #3890

    Jason Adamson
    Participant

    Ray,
    Keith will definitely help you out with options and opinions. Like I said, my sail is going on its 6th season and is still winning. The cloth, Carbon GPL, has held up extremely well with little to no wear showing. The only change has been the shape, but that’s to be expected with its constant use and sometimes abuse. Good luck with the race to Cuba, man that sounds like it’ll be fun.

    #3891

    Ray
    Participant

    Thank you for the great advice, guys- you’re probably going to think I’m nuts, but I’ve put in an order with Sail Technologies here in St Pete. I did it for several reasons- for one, I know the owner (Tom Barry) pretty well and I trust him. Two, our “house appropriations committee” (aka my sweetie pie), who I know even better than Tom and love more than anything else in the world (even more than sailing) vetoed the sail request bill before it got off the floor. That, and one of my crew who has tons of O30 experience (on the first one ever built back when he lived in SF as a kid) advised me to go with Tom and all of the reasons why- besides being local. Only time will tell, but I have declared myself fairly well here in our phrf fleet, so I should be able to see some differences in performance relative to the other boats… hopefully, in the right direction.

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