Forum Replies Created
August 30, 2017 at 9:04 pm in reply to: Crew seating when spinnaker reaching with the twing on #5135
We run our sheets outside the life lines and typically don’t use twings unless it is very windy. Crew sits on the rail with the guy either at their chest or higher depending how far back they are. Reason we run outside is when sailing DDW the sheets/guys are naturally outside with the pole back, and reaching the stanchions keep the lines outside w/o issue.
Awesome Jim, wow a HI Nationals would be fun. Good luck to all the Olsons.
Well you are going to have to convince Kevin to ship her over.
Results can be found here:
I think people have gone complacent in that they enjoy their boats and enjoy racing PHRF but look at Nationals as something beyond them. Unfortunately our OD rules are pretty lax and result in many modifications to the boats that are probably skirting a very thin line on legal. But when raced in PHRF they can get by and no one is the wiser. But beyond that I think most of the boats that sail PHRF have seen better days and would require an investment the owners are not willing to make to race competitively in OD. There are plenty of good boats available for purchase, but that requires an investment that people right now just don’t have.
Having said that, last year we had 6 Olson’s signed up for our local Charity Regatta, 5 raced, and it was a great time. If anyone is interested I’m sure we could add a day to the regatta and make it a Nationals event. This year it is scheduled for Aug 20 & 21, DPYC Charity Regatta Weather that time is usually very pleasant with winds between 10-15knts typical. Racing is outside the harbor so swell and waves are available for those whom prefer it.
The class has seen a decline these past 2 years, possibly due to lack of class management. I mean who’s our president anyways???? I’d love to see even 8-10 boats on the line but I will settle with 5-7. Whomever interested let me know and I will talk with the organizers and figure something out.
Keith will definitely help you out with options and opinions. Like I said, my sail is going on its 6th season and is still winning. The cloth, Carbon GPL, has held up extremely well with little to no wear showing. The only change has been the shape, but that’s to be expected with its constant use and sometimes abuse. Good luck with the race to Cuba, man that sounds like it’ll be fun.
I believe the length of the mast itself is somewhere close to 36 feet.
I know its a tough pill to swallow but sails, good sails, are not cheap. I a very happy Ullman Sails customer and their service is #1. My #1 GPL I got from them 6 years ago and the sail is still winning. The loft hates me because they want my business, but the damn thing just keeps going so I have no need to replace it! If you break up the cost you figure approx $500/year the sail costs so far. Who knows when I’ll have to replace it, but still its worth its weight in gold. You also don’t have to go for the highest priced sail, all of their products are of the highest quality, every material has its advantages/disadvantages.
PS $1800 sounds pretty cheap to me, I’d be weary of the material quality/craftsmanship going into that sail.
If you need results I can attest that a boat stiffened with class approved measures is equal to one without. I actively race against another Olson, I have no stiffeners, no BOD, or jockstraps and I am a single spreader. My competition has all the class approved stiffeners and a double spreader rig. Right now we are exactly tied for position in our clubs series races.
Stiffening and re-enforcement of the boats helps to reduce loads on an old structure, they do not increase performance. Drivers skill, picking the right side of the course and sail conditions/hull conditions have a much greater effect on speed.
+6 sec a mile is ridiculous, you might as well have gone from an aluminum rig to carbon for that penalty.
As a side note our local PHRF board, PHRF SoCal, has recently adopted a +1/-1 sec/mile adjustment scheme to more fairly rate any performance modifications.
I do not have any wedges in my mast. The opening for the mast is pretty tight as is. I’m not really sure there is a need for wedges to be honest.
I find Cunningham (tricky pig) rigging to be a matter of taste and what is available. My set up is an old line run from the cockpit thru a spare slot in a deck organizer to a turning block at the base of the mast. Up thru the main back down and tied to the vang attachment with a simple bowline. Most of the time I leave it loose and try to get the main halyard set properly first, adjusting tension during prestart then downwind legs. Some speed wrinkles are ok in my book. Cunningham comes on when its breezy and we really need to flatten the main. By the way does anyone still use the flattener reef in the main? Mine isn’t even rigged, but the cringle is there for it.
As SWG stated it looks like the venue is undecided at this moment. Issues with Lake levels and access to docks is making it difficult to get things situated in Tahoe. There are talks of having either Richmond YC host, or having the venue in So Cal so where. Nothing has been confirmed. Todd seems to have the low down but even he isn’t sure where its gonna be.
Yes you are correct. But is also allows the pole to do this on its own when the wind is light and pressure on the kite is low.
My foreguy was set up similar to yours until recently when I changed to what I described above. The new arrangement is nice for clearing up the foredeck to move sails and also for take downs to keep sheets clear. Only issue I’ve had has been the pole tends to want to swing aft more, especially in lite air, leaving the clew of the spinnaker floating free. With the original set up the foreguy pulled foreward slightly creating a triangle effect.
Spinnaker halyard size if I remember correctly is 8mm Endura Braid, 75ft.
Mines pretty standard:
2 Spinnaker Halyards, both on the mast
1 Jibe Halyard led aft to the cockpit starboard side
1 Main Halyard led aft to the cockpit port side
4 winches, two on the cabin top for halyard/spin sheet work and 2 primary self tailors for jib sheets
Vang is a 4:1 on a 2:1 cascade with boomkicker
Mainsheet is 6:1
Backstay is cascade with a total of 24:1 split and led to two cam cleats on the aft edge of the cockpit.
Foreguy is run to both sides of the cabin top next to the secondary winches. It travels forward thru blocks at the base of the mast then to the pole. One continuous line.
Topping lift is led thru a cam cleat, down to a turning block and left to lye on the deck. This allows crew on the rail to make the topping lift without getting up.
That track in front of your mast is most likely for the Babystay. Original single spreader rigs (like mine) have a Babystay to control mast shape. I have removed mine for the time being since I sail in predominately light winds. Heavy air I can rig up a temporary solution.
White Lightning #133
Thanks Bruce, I am envious of you project. Opening up the cockpit has been a thought in my mind for awhile. I’ve sailed on other boats, H33 and SC50, that have done this and it makes the boat feel so much bigger. I look forward to seeing pictures and status updates on your progress.
Pictures of the shirts have been posted on the front page
7 boats entered so far for this years National Championship. Lets see if we can hit double digits! Go to http://www.lbrw.org for entries.
Dont scrap her. Come up with a price and try to sell her as is. I believe a new rig runs somewhere around 8k. I am sure someone on this site knows someone who’d be interested in her. Post to the classifieds.
On my boat I typically sail with 6-7. My fordeck is pretty clean, and I have the foreguy running to the middle of the foredeck rather than at the mast base. We always hatch launch as it keeps the cockpit clear and no bags to deal with after the hoist. My spin halyards are cleated on the mast thru jammers and my topping lift is on the starboard side of the mast thru a cam cleat.
On hoists the only thing to do it snap the pole on the mast ring and have the mast man hoist the topper from a seated position on the rail. Bow man (woman in my case) gets off the rail right before the hoist to open the hatch and help pull some kite out while the mast man is hoisting the halyard.
On douses I try to sail a little hotter of an angle right before the mark then turn down so the bow can grab the spin guy and bring the sail around to weather without too much pressure. While this is happening the mast man is triping the pole to release the guy and then poping the topper to drop the pole down on deck, shoving it back between the cabin house and the shrouds to keep everything clear. As soon as that is complete and bow has the foot around the mast man dumps the halyard and bow collects/shoves the kite back into the forward hatch. Mean while the cockpit is dealing with the jib and I am driving/trimming the main.
Gybes are done best with a steady hand and slow turn from the driver. Most foul ups I’ve seen racing are not the fault of the bow but the driver turning too fast and not watching the foredeck movements. Having done bow and now driving I rely on my foredeck to tell me when to turn not the other way around. Twings definitely help in breeze, in the light you can get away without them. They steady the kite and actually center the effort.
Like most things in sailing, practice makes perfect and having a steady trustworthy crew is probably the most important item you’ll ever have on the boat.
PS I sail with my local sailmaker and he is all about simplicity, the fewer lines the better. My spin halyards are on the mast, jib and main are back to either side of the companionway, topper on the mast and foreguy to the starboard aft edge of the cabin top. In fact he and I also race on an SC 50 that he has simplified to the point of no mast track for the pole, just two pin locations for the but end. Very similar to the J24.
I am sorry we couldn’t wrangle up a boat for you this year. The conditions were perfect and the class had a great time. I does irritate me that no one was willing to share their boat and actually make some money in the process. We are again doing the Nationals at LBRW next year and I sure hope this time we can get you a boat. And hopefully the class will be able to supply actual prizes to those who trophy.
I do understand that the class tries to keep up with weaknesses and address them in a way that is fair to all competitors. I just don’t see this a known weakness, there are many many factors at play here outside of a flexible hull.
First, if we are basing our opinions off of one person who is having issues with rig tension then we need to look at that specific boat to see what the problem is. It sounds to me like there may be an issue here with the mast step more than a flexible hull.
Second, if you are concerned with this problem and you believe it is a major issue (which I personally do not) then I would suggest you invest in a NA personally. If results from his evaluation prove there is an inherent flaw in the design then we as a class can investigate further to eliminate it.
Lastly, as everyone knows when we go about updating/changing rules to improve the boat we will always encounter the “if’s” of life. “If we really want to improve the boat we should allow carbon rigs”. “If we want to gain better control we should allow carbon rudder blades”…The “if’s” Again I believe the idea of the Olson was to have a fast, fun and affordable boat that every man could enjoy. I would hate to see this turn into an arms race with people spending exorbitant amounts of money just to gain the advantage. I mean we can’t even get the class to vote on the idea of allowing the stern rail to be opened for easy access to the motor…imagine trying to decide on what materials are allowed for hull stiffening.
I would much rather see the class money spent on promoting and expanding class events. I want to see “prizes” awarded for those who earn them in regatta’s. I want to see participation in Nationals and NA Championship regatta’s go up. That is what the funds, and I use that term loosely, are there for. Let’s get people out and racing.
I appreciate the open discussion that has been created and if people want to see changes made to the Class By-Laws then I would suggest they do as we did this year and form a list to be sent to the next general meeting. Along with that list I would encourage everyone to attend or send their Proxy vote in so we can vote on these changes.
2013 Class President
I have to say I feel pretty lucky to not be experiencing much of any type of flex in the hull. Sure I have a couple soft spots in the deck, but that is understandable from the age of the boat. I think we need to take a look at what we are expecting from a 30+ year old boat, built of fiberglass and wood. Both these materials bend and flex, and over time they fatigue. If you really want to solve the problem why not just do a total makeover and use carbon/kevlar to re-enforce the hull and deck. I enjoy the boat and appreciate it for what it is. If you want a stiff hull, buy a new boat. I don’t have jock straps or a BOD, nor do I have a dbl spreader rig, but I do fine in our fleet and really can’t see spending money on a NA only to be told that “hey it’s 30 yrs old what do you want from it?”
Bigger issues then minute amount of flex are going to slow you down, like slow tacks, old sails, a rig that isn’t in tune, too little weight, too much weight, poor bottoms…and on and on. Before we go spending the class’s money, which isn’t a lot, maybe we should just focus on fine tuning our own skills. Enjoy the boat go win races but don’t expect miracles when pushed against newer updated designs.
Ya the great state of CA. Well last year the boat was valued at 10k which I believe is reasonable. This year is jumped to 18k. Now I wish our home prices would make that kind of gain in 1 year.
Good luck Jim. Sounds like a real rig buster.
Due to the growth in the class this year, up to about 40+ members, we were unable to vote on any changes at this years Annual Meeting. No changes were made to the Class Constitution. We would like to keep this tread going for next year. We will also work on getting Proxy’s out to the members so a vote can be made by those attending the Annual meeting. Next years meeting will be held on June 29th at ABYC. This is in conjunction with next years National Championship during LBRW June 28-30th 2013.
Thanks to everyone who bought a shirt, I have 1 shirt left, it is the 3XL. If anyone’s interested just shoot me an email.
According to the constitution you are allowed storm sails plus 6 additional sails including a mainsail. Just FYI
7) MAXIMUM NUMBER OF SAILS ON BOARD: For any sanctioned event a maximum of six sails including the mainsail and exclusive of storm jibs may be carried on board.
Here’s the link for results. I’ll do a short write up for the front page tomorrow. Just got done putting the boat away. It was a great event, congrats to Blue Star for another flawless race. Looking forward to seeing everyone next year.
Mooring assignments have been posted at http://www.lbrw.org. All Olson 30’s will be docked at ABYC.